[MUSIC]
>> I am.
>> Dude, it's working.
>> What's really funny is that
I didn't answer the phone
though.
>> You didn't answer the phone?
>> That's number one.
>> What do you mean?
>> I don't know, it's just rag
and all of a sudden you were
talking.
>> Okay, I'll take it.
>> That was cool.
Number one, number two, here's
the other weird thing.
I can hear you through my
headphones, but I can't hear me
through my headphones.
Which is all right, I just sort
of believe.
I just sort of believe if you
can hear me, then you'll be
fine and
I don't need to hear myself.
>> Yeah, it's okay because I'm
actually, hold on.
>> So now do I get some of that
cool reverb too?
>> Here's the bum bummer.
Shit, this is really hard, hold
on.
>> What happened?
>> It's delaying a little bit.
Hold on, that's better.
Well, maybe if I don't.
I see it's coming back now.
>> Back now.
>> I see the problem.
>> We got a loop go in there,
huh?
I can hear myself now.
>> I can hear myself now.
>> Yeah, you don't want- >> Wow
, wow, wow.
Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa,
whoa, whoa.
We had that kind of delay once
during a webcast at Harvard and
we were able to sing row, row,
row your boat with ourselves.
You know, like a little round
thing, the delay was that good.
>> Really?
>> Yeah, it was pretty funny.
>> Okay, if I turn this down a
bit.
>> Boy, they really got zapped
and Haiti, you know.
This hurricane, it's coming up,
it's really-
>> Hold on a second, Dave.
>> Yeah.
>> I just wanna set this up.
One, two, check one, two.
Can you talk for a sec?
>> I can talk for a sec.
>> Yeah, okay.
>> Hello, this is Dr. Dave
coming.
>> It was so cool, and then
Doug Kay, I'm gonna play
do that on my next source code.
Doug Kay came back with the
correction on the settings Dr.
Dave advised.
Yeah, it was perfect, it was so
perfect.
Did you hear the Gilmore gang?
>> I haven't yet.
>> Oh, dude, they're all over
iPodder.
>> Really, good.
>> Yeah, and of course some of
the guys-
>> Finally, finally, finally,
finally,
they have some technology to
talk about.
>> It really, and then one of
the guys says,
you know, Adam Curry, the ex VH
1 VJ, I'm like, oh fuck.
That hurt, man, it fucking hurt
.
>> You're getting old, you're
getting old.
>> That sucks.
>> You're ass stags, literally,
as they say those words.
>> Oh, Dave.
May the hair god punish you
even more.
>> [LAUGH]
>> Shit.
>> Listen, worse than it could
be worse,
I just saw a thing on Donald
Trump.
>> No kidding.
>> And they had a picture of
him 20 years ago,
and he actually looked pretty
good.
>> [LAUGH]
>> Back in the day, yeah, the
Donald was looking good.
>> Yeah, exactly, well, he was
in New York icon in the 80s.
>> Yep.
I was living in New York during
the 80s.
>> I know, that's why I
mentioned it.
I know, I think if you watch
that show,
you may get a glimpse of your
future.
>> Gee, thanks, Dave.
>> No, that's all right.
Well, he's a very innovative
guy, don't you think?
>> I think I'm extremely
innovative.
>> Yeah, and he is too, though.
>> [LAUGH]
>> It's funny because I'm
exactly in the middle age-wise
between the two of you.
>> Yeah, how old is Trump?
Is he 60?
>> He's 10 years older than me.
>> Yes, he's 59.
>> 59, yeah.
And you're just turning 40.
>> Yeah.
>> He's still got a ways to go
before you're old.
>> Man, I tell you.
So, okay, you said the reason
we're recording this, you ch
atted me.
You chatted me up, you bitch.
>> Yeah.
>> You chatted me up and said
that there's a VP debate
tomorrow.
>> Yeah, I just heard this,
that we're on the eve of the VP
debate.
I have to go look into this,
but that could be just as good
in many ways as the debate
between Kerry and Bush because
Cheney is kind of an asshole.
>> [LAUGH]
>> Okay, just kind of.
>> Well, it's kind of, I'm sure
his wife doesn't think she,
well, maybe she does.
>> Yeah, you don't know.
>> Yeah, it could be, so that
could be kind of interesting.
But I thought it would be fun
to have people, if we could
swing it technically,
to have people be able to call
in during the debate.
Cuz we'd all have something we
could watch at the same time
and something to
respond to.
So that way, if you and I
happen to miss one of the lies
that Bush was telling,
we're gonna overlook the ones
that Kerry tells, of course.
>> Of course.
>> [LAUGH]
>> If we have to catch a lie or
miss one, then somebody else
might catch it.
It's sort of like, they can
catch it.
>> Okay, but the problem here
with the call in is that, gee,
boy.
>> Maybe that's pushing it.
That sounds like it's pushing
it.
>> Well, no, no.
I mean, what I'd like to do is,
first I'd like to see if we can
even get our
audio synced up, cuz there
could be a significant delay
between what you get
from CNN and what I get from
CNN, which will also make it
interesting.
But I wanna try and stick to
all the known factors before we
go.
>> Well, how much of a delay do
you think there would be?
>> Well, I've seen satellite
delays of many, many seconds.
>> Really?
>> Yeah, come on, hold on a
second, Dave, what baby?
>> [INAUDIBLE]
>> Yeah, I've been if and on
Bella.
>> Ate a nuclear?
>> [INAUDIBLE]
>> Is that snacks or is it a-
>> [INAUDIBLE]
>> I was just served my
Saturday snack, thank you dear.
>> [INAUDIBLE]
>> Okay, I'm talking to Dave,
the one you laugh so
loud about?
>> [INAUDIBLE]
>> Why did she laugh at me or
with me?
>> No, she was laughing at your
Bush commentary.
>> Yeah.
>> Really?
>> Yeah, she cracked up when
you said he's lying like a
motherfucker.
>> [LAUGH]
>> Cracked up.
>> I felt like we were doing a
golf show or something.
>> It was great, it was perfect
.
>> [LAUGH]
>> But that's exactly what it's
like.
>> Yeah, I was like, okay, we
're watching President Bush here
in the Rose Garden.
And he's taking out a three
club, a three wood.
>> And he pulls up one every
month.
>> [LAUGH]
>> That's funny, I'm glad, I
was entertained by two, it
could be much better.
>> Rushland both did a
wonderful job with Kerry, I was
laughing out loud.
It was funny.
>> Was that on the radio?
>> Yeah, it was on the radio.
>> Shit, I wish I could hear
that.
>> Well, it's long gone, but I
was in Pennsylvania on my
beginning,
my cross country drive.
And I think he had recorded the
Kerry speech.
>> A lot of his stuff was
recorded.
>> Yeah, and so he had it on
this loop thing, and he would
press the button and
Kerry would say the thing.
And then he'd go, I can't
comment on this.
And then he would say, I have
to hit pause.
>> [LAUGH]
>> That's what I do on the
source code.
>> That's fun.
>> And then he would, yeah, of
course, then he would hit back
space.
And then he would play it again
.
And he'd get angry all over it.
>> [LAUGH]
>> And he would blame Kerry for
repeating himself,
which I thought was the most
beautiful little thing he did.
>> Yeah.
>> Kerry actually wasn't
repeating himself,
he was just repeatedly playing
the thing Kerry had said.
>> [LAUGH]
>> Exactly.
>> Well, but you want to do
this live, right?
>> I don't know, I don't know
how I want to do it.
I just think we ought to do
more trade secrets things,
because there's more stuff to
talk about, number one.
>> Number two is I've been
getting a universally very,
very positive response from
people about this.
Yeah, they really like it.
Scobal, I had dinner with Rod
ney Scobal.
>> And we know his boss.
>> Oh yeah.
>> [LAUGH]
>> Yep, and-
>> What did he have to say?
>> His boss?
>> No, Scobal.
>> I don't know what his boss
said.
Scobal said, Scobal said, you
're gonna get a radio contract
within two weeks.
>> Well, you know what?
It's very easy to perceive this
being on the radio,
because it's what people want
to listen to during drive time.
>> I like a mother tongue.
>> Hey, Christina.
>> I like a mother tongue.
>> That's my daughter now
walking in.
She's 14, thanks, Dave.
>> No, I swear it backwards.
>> You've corrupted the youth
of America.
>> [LAUGH]
>> Listen.
>> Damn.
>> He used words like, "How the
fuck are we gonna be on the
radio?"
>> Oh, that's a good point.
No.
>> We have to stop using words
like that.
He's lying like somebody else's
mother.
>> Yeah, but see, then already
it's not as fun.
>> Of course, it's not gonna be
as fun.
>> So maybe we don't have to
strive for a radio contract.
I think the massive amounts of
iPods may do it for us.
>> That's true, yeah.
I heard the thing you were
talking about with Orl.
Was that Andrew Orlasky?
Was that the same Andrew Orlask
y that routinely trashes all the
bloggers here?
>> I have no idea.
I've never read any of his
stuff, but
I thought this was an amazing
piece.
>> It was, given what he said.
We have to figure out if this
is the same guy.
>> He's from Australia, I think
?
>> Yeah, probably isn't the
same guy then.
>> Maybe that one.
>> It was President, but it was
-
>> No, he's in the UK, I'm
sorry.
He's in the UK.
>> That's the same Andrew.
>> Okay, yeah.
>> It was both President and
ignorant at the same time.
It was magnificent, both of
both.
I mean, he forecast what was
actually going to happen,
except that his forecast was
off by a few years, right?
>> Five.
>> Five, yeah.
>> Yeah, he says iPods are
going to fill themselves within
five years, and
Apple won't build it, but
someone else will.
Yeah, dude, we did.
Hope, I'm losing you, Dave.
Are you there?
Hello?
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah, what happened there?
>> I don't know.
>> Well, it's just a connection
all of a sudden dropped out.
>> Good, I thought I figured it
was exactly six minutes.
>> No, that's what your instant
message was.
No, no, no, in fact, we're now
10 minutes and 37 seconds.
Now I'm not too worried about
that.
Here he comes, it's Murphy.
>> Yeah, hey, he's lying like a
motherfucker.
>> Yeah, yeah.
>> Excuse me, for those people
who didn't listen to this,
apparently this is going to
actually-
>> You need to speak up a
little bit, Dave, you're a
little bit soft.
>> Actually, it seems like this
is actually going to make it to
like on the internet and stuff,
right?
>> About this?
>> Yeah, of course.
>> Okay, so for the people
listening at home, it's very
important that you-
>> Or in your car or on your
walk.
>> In your car or walk.
>> Or while you're exercising.
>> Or whatever it is that you
're doing.
>> It's plane spotting.
>> Plane spotting.
What are you eating?
>> Look, this wasn't a planned
show.
I'm eating, I have a nice
avocado with shrimp.
I have some olives and I have
some French bread with crab,
cocktail stuff and
peppers and it's a weekend at
the castle.
>> The quality of my connection
went really way down.
>> No, I'm sorry.
I'll stop eating that'll help.
>> I think that-
>> Can you hear me?
>> Yeah, I hear you fine.
>> Can, really?
Okay, it's funny.
>> Maybe you have something
running, maybe you got mail
running or something and it's-
>> It's a swirling emotion.
>> You got something running in
the background, maybe your
email is sucking it in.
>> I don't know.
>> Okay, I can hear you fine.
>> All right, so what else are
we, yeah, so we just got an
email from Andre Radka and
you should be on the mail list
now, the Frontier Colonel mail
list.
>> Yeah, I signed up, you sent
me the email, thanks.
>> And so we've got the first
sort of candidate,
release candidate for the open
source release of Frontier.
>> Really, is it already
available?
>> Yeah.
>> So what can I do with this?
I can download it and do what?
>> Okay, that was really
bizarre the way that sounded.
>> Robocopping, we call that.
>> What was the name of that
guy, that robotic-
>> Max Headroom.
>> That's it, you sound just
like Max Headroom.
>> I look like him too at the
moment.
>> How did you know?
>> Because, you know, it's like
we're on the same wavelength,
Dave.
>> I'm touching the laptop,
maybe it's actually the TCP/IP
connection is
sending brain waves.
>> [LAUGH]
>> It's possible.
Okay, so the open source
release of Frontier.
>> So here's what you can do
with it.
I did understand the question,
even if it did sound bizarre.
First of all, you have to have
metroworks environment.
>> Code warrior, is that what
that is?
>> Code warrior, that's right.
And they have it available for
both Windows and for Macintosh,
which are the two platforms
that this code runs on.
And then there are build
instructions that actually,
I think we still need to post
those, but you can sort of
figure it out.
And then what happens is, you
build it and it turns into
Frontier.exe.
Then you, but however you can
make changes to it before.
And before you compile it.
So now you have the license to
create your own like Frontier
if you want to.
>> And you could, you can use
it to,
how big is the kernel actually
in file size?
>> I don't know, I haven't
looked in a while.
Let's see.
You mean like when it's
compiled, right?
>> Yeah, what size is the Front
ier.exe?
Yeah, how big is Frontier.exe
when you compile it?
>> We need to do another.
We need to, let's recreate this
connection.
I can't have a conversation
this way.
>> Okay, I'll call you back.
>> Yeah, can you call me back?
>> Yeah, I'd love to call you
back.
All right.
>> Hello?
>> Yeah, much faster than
regular phone service, eh?
>> My God.
That was scary.
I mean, you sounded like you
were crazy there at the end.
>> I am.
>> I was, I was, I was, I was,
I was delaying like brrrrr.
Wait a minute, Christina, are
you downloading something?
>> No.
>> We've got to check, you know
,
she got line wire running again
.
>> She's lying like a
motherfucker.
>> I have the headphones on,
thank God.
She didn't hear that.
>> Tell her what I said.
>> Dave said you're lying like
a motherfucker.
Now we get the, the, the
teenager cold shoulder.
We don't get any, no response.
She's on MSN talking to 8,000
people at once.
>> Really?
>> Mm-hm.
>> Interesting.
>> Mm-hm.
>> You're breaking up again.
That's the whole thing is
happening again.
>> I can hear you fine.
>> MSN.
Yeah, well, we can't have a
discussion this way.
>> But are you, but you must be
running your mail client
or something's running that you
're going to have to shut off.
>> All right, all right, all
right, hold on.
>> Mm-hm.
>> Let me just close the bunch
of stuff now.
All right, I'm closing AOL.
I just closed, closed Norton An
ivirus.
That shirt uses up a lot.
>> That'll, although I don't
think,
I don't think it was actually
running though.
Okay, so now I'm closing AIM.
>> Mm-hm.
>> All right, now I'm closing,
I don't want to close Skype, no
?
>> No, no, keep that running.
>> That would suck.
>> Yeah, Skype would be the
thing I would not want to quit.
>> No.
>> iTunes, that could be it.
I, iTunes just wants itself
whenever it feels like it,
it really pisses me off.
>> Whenever it feels like it.
>> Yeah.
>> But you probably have an iP
od or script running,
one of those damn things,
launching your iTunes all over
the place.
>> Excuse me, but I don't run
that shit, all right?
>> No, you're too hardcore.
>> Yeah.
>> I have to go download the
fucking source to Frontier,
but you won't even install a
freaking application.
>> Now you're talking all that
slow way again,
you're, I have to go install
your app.
>> That's too bad, because I
can hear you just
perfectly, that really sucks.
>> Like, hey, this can't be
very good.
>> Well, you sound fine.
>> I know, I know, except when
I'm imitating you.
>> Yeah, why don't you call me
back then?
>> All right, let's try that,
hold on, I'll go away.
[BELL RINGING]
One ring eating, one ring
eating, two ring eating-ies.
All right, say something.
>> Yeah, I'm on.
>> That's better.
>> Okay.
>> I think we're still doing
one of those trade secret shows
where we're not doing anything
other than talking about trade
secrets.
>> Well, you want to do the
Skype test.
>> I can't function the way we
were doing it, so, all right,
this may be better.
>> Okay, is this working okay
for you?
>> So far, so good.
>> Okay, good.
>> All right, so now the
question is, let me just find
out
what the size of this stuff is,
because you asked, right?
>> Mm-hm.
>> All right, let's go explore.
And it's not that big,
basically, it's the--
>> Yeah?
>> [INAUDIBLE]
>> Let's see.
Hey, you know, I'd love to have
some of that food you're eating
,
Erica.
>> I'm telling you, Patricia
just joined us.
She said she can't hear me or
you because I have the
headphones
on, but she's-- now she's
eating.
What do you have there?
>> Avocado.
>> Lettuce.
>> Mm-hm.
>> And shrimp and dachshund.
>> That's rabbit food.
>> No.
>> That's healthy food,
actually.
>> Yeah, and you have, what is
that, sun-dried tomatoes?
>> Sun-dried tomatoes and--
>> And what is this?
>> And it is some--
>> Wrap.
>> Yeah, some wrap.
>> Tortilla, tortilla.
>> Now, could you ask her to
sing that song
as she sang for us, yeah?
>> Or it's like asking a
comedian to tell a joke.
>> Tell a joke.
>> Or a programmer to write
some code.
>> Write some code.
>> Yeah.
No, I will not ask.
>> What was that song?
What was that?
>> Mambo Italiano.
>> That's what it was.
>> Yeah, would you like it?
>> Oh, yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah, it was funny.
I was listening.
>> She says not bad for a heart
patient.
>> No, that's exactly what I
was thinking
while she was doing it.
>> That's exactly what he was
thinking.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah, she thought that was
really good.
You're-- you're--
>> One heart patient.
>> One heart patient to another
here.
With me in the middle, I don't
think that's a good place to be
.
>> Why not?
>> Just kidding.
>> You have to take full of us
old heart patients
in our old age or whatever.
>> Yeah, someone's got to watch
over you guys.
>> Exactly.
So it's 1357K.
So it's about 1.3 megs.
>> Oh, that's nothing.
>> It's tiny compared to an MP3
.
I mean, you know--
>> But you could actually code
all kinds of stuff
into the kernel.
>> Yeah.
>> And turn that into an
application.
>> Yeah.
Like, for example, one of the
things I wanted to do--
>> Is create iPod or--
>> Well, that wasn't what I was
going to say.
>> No.
>> I don't know.
You guys seem to be doing so
good with that.
I'm not sure we need to do that
.
>> Well, the publishing side is
where we're going to run
into problems.
And I've been thinking about
this a lot.
You know, because either you're
going to interface
with existing weblog software
that'll create an RSS file,
or you're going to basically go
back and do all that work again
.
And I think that's pretty silly
.
>> No, you don't want to
recreate a weblog--
>> No, of course not.
But that's exactly the
infrastructure we want to
publish.
>> Well, OK, so you've got--
let's go through this.
WordPress sounds like they're
going to do it, right?
>> Well, they already have an
enclosure support running.
>> Right.
And I have half of it in Manila
.
OK, that's part of what I did
for secrets at scripting.com.
>> Yeah, I'd love to have that
code.
>> I don't have the user
interface.
So I'll give you the code.
>> OK, great.
>> Yeah.
>> But first, let me put a user
interface on it
so that you can type the URL in
.
So you don't have to go into
web edit and put it in there,
because that's the way I have
to do it right now.
>> Oh, OK, yeah, that's not a
very convenient way.
>> Yeah, that's not going to go
over--
well, but it's very-- the easy
part, I think,
is the user interface.
The hard part was figuring out
how to fit it in.
>> Well, wouldn't you do it
just like--
just like radio--
>> Because that's Manila.
>> I'm sorry, I was going to
say, wouldn't you do it just
like radio use land?
>> It's very much like radio.
>> Yeah.
>> Sure, it's very much like
radio use land.
But it's Manila, because Manila
is a different model.
It's a dynamic content
management system, whereas
radio--
you know, it's the question of
deep frying versus baking.
Manila is deep fried, radio is
baked.
But what was I going to say?
So you've got radio, you're
going to have Manila soon,
movable type, probably should--
they should do it.
I don't know.
Brent sort of did a half-ass
job.
>> On what?
On net new--
>> On the closures.
On the other side, actually.
>> Oh, OK, on the publishing
side, right.
>> I don't know what he is so
scared of.
You know, he's been saying for
the longest time that it freaks
him out this idea of
downloading in closures.
>> Really?
>> You know.
>> Well, they now support it.
Did you see the post I pointed
to?
>> Yeah, of course I did.
But it wasn't-- you know, it
wasn't--
>> He didn't actually put it in
.
He said, here's how you do it.
>> Right, but why not put it in
?
>> I don't know.
It's a lot easier for him to
put it in.
It's a lot easier for him to
put it in than it is for you
to hack it up with an Apple
script.
>> Yeah.
>> Oh, just as in--
>> He's trying to avoid some
kind of support issue.
>> Really?
>> Well, I mean, you know, I
don't know.
>> It may be valid.
>> No, it's not.
>> OK, can you just talk a
little bit more into the mic,
Dave, so we can just all hear
you at home?
>> It's like totally right up
to my mouth.
>> Can you just stick it in a
little further?
>> No.
[LAUGHTER]
>> I'm going to get--
anyway, so like I'm already
saying politically incorrect
things here, you know.
I didn't even ask.
>> It's OK.
>> Yeah.
Well, the other thing I wanted
to say about Brent's thing
is why the hell doesn't he give
some credit to XMLRPC, you
know, and to the MetaWeblog API
, which made all of that stuff
in MarsEdit possible.
>> Yeah.
>> I mean, this guy goes out of
his way to make nice
to the Adam people.
Why not go out of his way to be
nice to the MetaWeblog API
people?
>> Oh, so you want-- what you
want is you want a credit line?
>> Well, I'd love him to say
that, hey, you know,
the technology works.
These guys did a great job.
If it weren't for what they had
done,
I wouldn't be able to do this,
you know.
And he's out there taking the
credit for it.
Everybody goes, well, Brent's a
great guy.
And Brent is a great guy.
>> Well, he's a great integr
ator.
It's not-- you know.
>> But he's building on the
work of other people.
And he has really gone out of
his way to praise the Adam
people.
And I don't know why he doesn't
-- now, you know,
he likes to say he's being fair
, right?
But no, it's fair would be to
say, I'm not really using any
of the Adam guys stuff here.
>> But can I just ask, why do
you care?
>> Yeah, that's why I keep
sitting to myself.
>> Really?
Why?
I mean, let me give you a
perfect example.
So all of a sudden, iPod takes
off, right?
And it's great because I'm
being credited on web blogs.
And being-- let me hear me out
for a second.
I'm being credited just about--
I sure hope it's recording my
voice.
>> Ah-ha, now he's getting
ready to say something.
He wants everybody to hear.
>> Wait, no, of course, it's
got to be recording.
>> Do you think it might not be
recording?
>> Hold on, let me just check.
I want to make sure so that
everyone can hear what I have
to say, god damn it.
Hold on.
>> Well, while you were waiting
,
I'll tell you why I care, OK?
There's first the irrational
reasons, OK?
Which unfortunately exist, OK?
And then there are the rational
reasons.
And the irrational ones is like
you work your ass off,
and you pay the price
physically and lifestyle wise.
>> Yeah.
And then you sort of like--
>> It's working, by the way.
I'm sorry.
It's working.
>> Sort of like people just say
, hey, thanks.
That was good work.
>> No, I understand.
>> Let me just finish on my
thought.
>> All right, go ahead.
>> Let me finish on my thought.
So, of course, and I get
credited--
into code even, I'm getting
credited.
It's fabulous.
I love it.
I'm not used to that, by the
way, because usually it's like
the Adam Curry from VH1 thing
that I just told you about,
right?
And that's going to happen.
And these guys were well--
their intentions were-- I think
were pretty good.
They actually were-- you should
listen to that.
When you hear the Gilmore Gang,
you'll understand
what I'm saying.
And they really meant well.
But even that, it's like, yeah,
that bothers you.
But at the end of the day--
[BURPING]
You know?
>> All right.
>> Seriously.
It's like, you know, you can't
go--
you-- people either give you
credit,
you can't say you owe me credit
.
It just doesn't work that way.
>> I didn't say that.
Those are the words I said.
>> No, but you said--
I wish that.
>> Yeah, I do.
And there's the-- OK, I was
starting to say there's the
semi-irrational reasons for it,
which I think are perfectly
legitimate.
And then there are the rational
reasons, which is that
basically you get written out
of the record, and then you
can't do it again.
In other words, every time you
try to do something new,
basically you face the same
obstacles you face the first
time you tried to do something
new.
If you don't get credit for
your successes, then people
will say, well, maybe this guy
knows what he's talking
about because he did X, Y, and
Z. And believe me, that
happens all the time.
I mean, people come in and take
credit for what I've done,
and they get to do it again.
But I know.
And that's--
>> Well, I'll give an example.
>> Very frustrating.
>> I'll give an example.
Here's something interesting.
So now forget it.
That's too long of an example.
>> Look, I understand what you
're saying.
Let me try to play it back to
you.
Like, if you do it--
if you try--
when you start doing something
like this, like
MetaWebLog, API, or XMRPC, you
say things like, well, I
just want this stuff to happen.
I don't really care how it
happens.
So to be consistent with that,
you'd have to say, well, I
said it then.
I should mean it now, right?
So I understand that.
And in fact, I see Brett saying
some of those things,
like where he says he really
likes the guy who writes
Ecto and this and that.
And I go to myself, boy, is he
setting him up because these
guys are going to nail his ass.
>> For what?
>> Why?
Because that's what happened to
me.
Basically, I said to some of
these guys, oh, no one owns
RSS.
You know what they heard?
You know what they heard, Adam?
>> Yeah, they heard I own RSS.
That's what they heard.
Yeah, I know.
But that's the way the human
brain works, man.
That's the way it works.
>> Right.
That's what Brett's walking
around into.
So anyway, I think that--
>> So what you should say--
check this out.
Check this out.
You should say, I do not want
any recognition.
I just don't want it.
I don't want the recognition
because it's just too much
attention.
I don't want it from people.
Please don't do-- stop doing
that.
Stop giving me attention or
recognition.
>> You know, I'm almost there.
Basically, what happened was
after I got sick two years ago,
I decided I'm not doing this
stuff for anybody but myself
anymore.
And I stopped releasing it.
I really did.
It was basically, I said, hard
for these guys.
>> You said what?
>> They don't appreciate--
so why am I working so hard for
these guys?
They don't appreciate it.
They never say thank you.
They don't give me credit for
it.
And I said the hell with it.
I'm not going to do it anymore.
And I don't.
I have a new content management
system that I use.
I'm sorry.
I do it for myself.
And I'm happy with it.
And maybe I'll share it with my
friends.
But I'm not going to be--
believe me, the world's got to
straighten this thing out.
It's got to learn how to value
generosity.
And I've had this talk with
Lessig.
And Lessig is just getting me
to get this, I think.
He sent me an email the other
day.
He said, well, have you pat
ented any of this stuff?
Because we're talking about
here.
And I said, no, Larry, it's
against my religion.
And he basically came back and
said, that's a good answer.
But why was he asking?
And that was good he was asking
.
Dave, hold on.
Hold on.
Let's just reconnect one second
, because now you're giving
the robo-cop on me.
One second.
Yeah, OK.
All right.
Beautiful.
Right.
So, Lessig.
Anyway, so they were talking
about iPod or Bill Moore Gang.
Yeah, you got to hear it.
And it's funny, because they
tried to talk about Sun
and their pay by the cycle hour
offering.
Well, they kept drifting back
to iPod.
And at the end of the show,
they're like, oh, we were
really all over the map.
We were talking about so many
different things.
Yeah, iPod-er.
It was great.
And then it was like--
and they were trying to find it
.
They're all online.
You've got to listen to this.
And it's like, iPod-er.
Doc Searle says, I can't find
it.
Just take me to Adam Curry's
web log.
And I said, no, no, it's iPod-
er.org.
.org.
They're all trying .com.
Well, let me get my two cents
in.
It's one of the most successful
development projects
on the net in the last few
years.
Really?
Maybe the most acceptable.
Whoa.
Because what happens is these
stupid mail lists get so bogged
down with all these people who
know better.
And they want to go back and
redo--
you had working five years ago.
And they are so persistent.
They have so much time.
They make the best out of it.
Did you see Steve Garfield's
contributions
to the iPod-er dev list?
No.
Oh, it's great.
He's a total user.
100% is great.
And he's like, this shit's--
I don't understand that it's
fucked up.
It's downloading things it
shouldn't.
I don't get it.
And people are all over trying
to help him, setting them up,
getting new releases out.
It's beautiful.
But that's the idea.
It's supposed to be downloading
shit all the time, right?
Yeah.
But there was-- one of the
concerns that everyone had,
of course, was you have these
beautiful iPod-er set up
with default feeds.
Or even if you just add a new
feed,
if someone's like Radio User
Land,
I think my default is 25 items
in an RSS feed, times 15
to 30 megs.
Hello.
So what we've come up with now
is it's configurable.
But the default is it downloads
the last three items.
And then on the next run, it'll
download the three before that.
And the next run, the three
before that,
until it's saturated.
Which is--
Maybe it shouldn't download all
the things in the feed.
Maybe it should only start
downloading with things
that are new after you've
subscribed.
Well, I think that everyone's
putting the options in
and the preferences.
But the question is, what is
the default?
Yeah.
What's the default going to be?
The default is all that matters
here.
Yeah, exactly.
Because first of all, you're
controlling first time behavior
.
Yeah.
And that's what we're screwing
up right now.
Yeah.
[INAUDIBLE]
Yeah.
We're still screwing that up a
little bit right now.
So we decided to call it mobile
blogging
and get inside step all the his
sy fitting.
And that seems like a fair--
Not.
Like a good--
Yeah.
Did you see that mobile blog
ging video clip I posted today?
You're gone again.
Really?
This sucks.
Wait, you're back now.
OK.
See, the thing was--
Did you see the mobile blogging
video clip I posted today?
I pointed to it?
No.
Oh, it's very cool.
It's two guys that are driving
from LA to New York
in a convertible.
And they had a camera on the
back of the car.
And they did a stop frame.
So in four minutes, you travel
with them from LA to New York.
It's beautiful.
I think I have seen that.
But it would be worth seeing.
Yeah, that is beautiful.
I've wanted that.
It's really nice.
My car was traveling across
country.
Yeah.
Well, this is exactly what they
did.
Hold on.
I've got to turn your volume up
a little bit.
How's that?
Well, I don't think Skype is
the answer out of my question.
No, it's-- and I was just about
to say,
because what Skype does very
well is the voice quality.
But when it comes to keeping
the connection,
we've had much better success
with the iChat and AIM.
Yeah.
People told me that I was
breaking up on iChat, though.
iChat, AIM.
But they weren't complaining
that much.
They were sort of saying it
kind of worked.
You know what it is?
At the end of the day, when you
're listening to AM radio,
you get used to it.
Well, what we need is we need
somebody
who does voiceover IP.
They can work with us.
And because I think we have
enough hardware here.
We have-- both have reasonably
good internet connections,
right?
Yeah.
Well, here's the next thing.
The next application I've been
dicking around with,
which may give us better
results, is--
you familiar with the Free
World Dial-up?
You ever heard of that?
No.
Do you remember Jeff Pulver?
You've probably seen his name
around.
Yeah.
Oh, he was-- I know who he was,
the supernova guy.
Could be.
He was the guy-- that was the
company that sponsored
Supernova.
Yeah, he's been around for a
long time.
Is that right?
Yeah, I think so.
So he started Free World Dial-
up, which is essentially
a voiceover IP network.
And you can connect to it for
free.
You can download the basic
software for free.
And what they're going to be
offering
is what everyone else is going
to be offering,
or is offering, is numbers you
can rent, virtual numbers,
so someone can dial a New York
number
and get your connection.
But also point to point, so why
don't you download from
FreeWorldDial-up.com?
Hold on.
Let me go there.
Yeah, you want to download the
X10 client.
It comes pre-configured.
You have to register.
That's not a big deal.
It's FreeWorldDial-up.
Yeah, this is good.
Let's just do the sit-down fly.
Well, I don't want to try to
download it while we're on
Skype.
Is that a buzz?
Come on, pussy.
Well, that'll screw up Skype.
Screw up Skype.
Skype is screwed up enough.
OK, all right, all right.
Here we go.
I mean, I guess it's going to
make any difference.
My account-- well, you're not
going
to have to put this stinking
microphone down now, you know?
If I have to create an account.
Oh, damn.
Well, benefits.
I don't know what to do.
Well, you aren't going to be
able to hear me.
That's for sure.
Hold on.
Oh, wait.
I hear there's a button that
says get FWD.
That must be it, right?
I don't know.
That's good marketing if it
works.
Yeah, get FWD phone.
Now, you want to--
It's pre-configured.
I don't really want to touch it
.
No, no, no, no.
You just want the free X10
client.
And you have to sign up.
Well, excuse me.
Where the fuck would that be?
Sorry.
I've been watching the Sopranos
too much.
Yeah, really?
Where the fuck would that be?
Hold on.
Let me see.
Free world.
So I hear they were talking
about iPod Run, IT
conversations.
No kidding.
Who was doing the talking?
That's what I wanted to know.
Steve actually started it off.
Yeah, he's got to have major
wood about iPod.
Yeah, he-- he--
he scyped me the other day, and
I wasn't around.
And I scyped him back, although
it said it was online.
It either didn't go through or
it didn't answer.
And he said at the end of the
show
that next week they were going
to talk about iPod
or iPod platform, et cetera.
So I was hoping that he was
calling to have me on the show.
That'd be cool.
So if I go to--
That would be sort of like
everything in one.
That would be daily source code
and IT conversations.
That would be what we would
call an integrated app.
Download it now.
Use it today.
Did that not catch your eye,
Dave?
Sorry.
Right in the middle of the page
.
Oh, there it is.
That big blob of purple.
Because excuse me, they have
lots of crap like that on it.
This is one of those pages
where the whole different
departments got the loop.
And though we need a big purple
blob here.
It's the purple download blob.
There are about 18 of them on
the damn page.
OK, so FWD IP phone light, is
that it?
Which one do I want?
Hold on, hold on, hold on.
Excuse me, you know I'm Windows
, right?
I'm not Mac.
Yeah, it does Windows.
So I want the FWD one.
That's the first one in the
list.
That's what you always get.
Let me just see.
The IP phone light.
No, no, no, hold on, hold on.
You want the FWD X light.
X light.
Good thing I asked.
Yeah, so then we'll have the
same client.
Oh, this will be interesting.
All right, I'm running it.
Oh, wow, that was quick.
Did you have an account?
No.
Well, it won't work without an
account.
I'm just doing what you told me
to.
I told you to sign up.
You did not.
Yeah, then you said I'll need
two hands to do that.
Yeah.
Stop downloading porn.
Wait, you're sending me the
porn.
Get with the program, will you?
Get with the program.
I'm watching Katie Wallace on
CNN.
That's porn.
Not really.
You know what really sucks?
You know what sucks about--
I'm using the--
Katie Wallace?
No.
About--
Actually, your name is Kelly
Wallace, though.
Audio hijack pro that I'm using
to record.
So it can record from any
application,
but only if that application is
actually
sending audio data.
And so Skype, whenever you--
Homeless, whenever you're quiet
like you are right now,
then it basically is not
sending out any audio.
And just for a split second, if
it doesn't receive the--
it should have like a time gate
on it.
For a split second, if the
audio is gone,
then basically the connection
shuts down.
And my mic channel still stays
active.
But then for some reason, it
goes into--
it just did it.
It goes into delay mode.
Then I hear myself delayed by
about half a second
on my headphones.
And I have to stop the mic and
start it again.
It's very irritating.
Hey, that sucks.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's no good.
You know, when Dr. Dave was
talking on your show yesterday,
you could hear that the
software he was using
was dropping out the blank
periods.
Oh, well, he wasn't using--
what he did is he pre-recorded
--
I know who Dr. Dave is.
This is one of these guys, and
I love him.
You know, he's probably--
well, I don't want to guess his
age.
Doesn't matter.
He sits at home.
He's got a studio.
He's got an ISDN box.
And ad companies, movie
companies, you know,
people call him up.
And they say, OK.
And he's just like the Jerry Se
infeld trailer for his movie.
And the guy goes, in a world
where women wear comfortable
shoes and aren't lesbians.
That kind of stuff.
And I'm sure that he recorded
his bit and then edited it.
Because I heard some--
either he edited it by hand or,
indeed, he had a silent stri
pper
just mush it all together.
You could hear it.
It was awful.
Yeah.
There was the big radio sound.
It was beautiful.
Really, it is the big radio
sound.
It's kind of like at the end of
the car commercials
where they tell you all the
different little legalities.
Yeah.
Your results may vary due to
road and weather conditions.
But we're prohibited by law.
That's the slow version.
[INAUDIBLE]
So have you registered yet?
No.
I only have one hand here.
Can I register?
I don't even know where to
register.
Oh, man.
Hold on.
I said, look for the blob.
I'm looking.
Hold on.
Oh, it's a little deep in.
Let's see.
This is stupid.
Gotten in Berber?
That was funny.
That was the marketing
department.
Get FWD.
That's what I clicked on.
Oh, sign up.
That's a sign up.
Sign up.
Right.
All right.
Step one is purchase pre-config
ured hardware
or download, blah, blah, blah.
Got that.
Yeah.
OK, great.
Plug in your phone to install
your software.
And you did that?
No.
I thought you installed it.
I thought it was running.
Yeah.
Oh, whoa.
Oh.
Gee, you'll install this free
world dial-up crap
from unknown IP.
Excuse me.
I'm busy accepting the
agreement.
I'll call you back.
I read the whole thing.
Excuse me.
To accept this agreement.
Welcome.
OK, this is great.
It says, welcome to the X-Bike
free world dial-up,
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,
blah, blah, blah, blah,
next.
OK, thanks.
Yaman!
Yo, buddy.
Well, that was fun.
Yeah.
For you.
That was about 45 minutes of d
icking around.
My side works.
How do you know yours works?
Oh, because there's a whole
bunch of numbers you can call.
You can call service numbers.
And it'll give you the weather
and the time.
And it has a voice-activated
system.
And there's a callback and an
echo check.
And all kinds of great stuff.
And--
So did you have to go through
all this shit
that I had to go through?
Even worse.
It's so fucking stupid.
I mean--
Why do they do this this way?
Why don't they test it with
human beings?
Well, I think it--
well, the Windows version that
you downloaded,
it comes preconfigured.
And that's right, because you
had all the information already
stored in there, right?
Yeah, but it was wrong.
What?
What do you mean it was wrong?
It didn't work.
Well, OK.
But that doesn't mean that the
information was wrong.
Because I'm using the same
information--
No, it doesn't.
Your setup is different from
what they expect.
That's probably what it is.
I have a clue for you, though.
Skype worked the first time.
No problem there.
Yeah, I know.
I know.
So somebody figured it out.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Isn't it funny how that works?
I mean, you know, I don't know.
It's really too bad, because
the X10 client--
now, of course, we don't know
how it sounds,
but it keeps the Audio Hijack
Pro running.
Hold on.
It keeps it running.
The minute you activate it,
then it just
keeps its audio channels open.
It doesn't cut off, so I don't
get that crappy delay.
So it'd be nice if we could--
Yeah, it'd be really nice if we
could--
So it's better technology, then
?
No, no.
I wouldn't say that at all.
I haven't heard the voice
quality yet.
And so far, the systems, which
are all automated,
that I've called, which are
computer voices,
I was not blown away by.
Let me just see--
Now you're slowing down again.
You're talking like you're
going through--
no, you're better now.
What were you saying about
Skype?
Oh, that's right.
Oops, oops, oops.
It's only 10.15 in the morning,
and I'm burned out too.
Chris, I hate farting around
with software out of my--
I've spent a whole life.
I gave my whole life for this.
I know.
All I want is it to work.
But it'll be so worth it if we
can get it to work.
All right.
Well, next time, we'll figure
this one out.
Yeah.
OK, so what are we going to do?
I wait--
[INAUDIBLE]
Sorry?
Yeah, go ahead.
Well, I was going to say, what
are we going to do?
We're going to try and do a
trade secrets during the VP
debate?
Well, I think we better do
another dry run, OK,
like this one, because just to
see if--
Well, Skype is clearly not the
answer,
because the quality is just--
Well, here's the deal.
--it drops out.
I've got to talk-- first of all
, you've
got to get me a description for
your blogger concession.
Yeah, yeah, I told you this
weekend.
I promised you this weekend.
Uh-huh, yeah.
Well, that means--
Yeah, well, there's a weekend
over.
Look, I can even go nine hours
into Monday
and still get it to you by the
weekend.
All right, OK.
I got to get the violin out.
Like, running conferences--
when I was at the Scobals the
other night,
these are both ex-conference gi
vers.
Scobals had a whole career
doing this.
And I said, there's nothing you
can do to get people to sort
of like realize that there's
only one person managing
this whole stinking conference.
And you know--
They'll never realize it, of
course not.
No, but it's the point is it's
another one of those deals
where I don't think I'm doing
this again.
Because when they say, hey, you
want to do a conference,
all I remember is the good shit
.
You know what I mean?
Hey, hold on.
Hold on.
I just got--
What?
What does error 407 mean?
That's what you were getting,
right?
Yeah.
This isn't--
Oh, yeah.
It's under the troubleshooting
tips.
This is an authentication error
.
This occurs most often when
your password
in your phone configuration
does not match the only--
the one currently assigned to
the FWD number.
You must use the password you
've chosen for your FWD account.
Note that if you change your
password
through the My Account section
of the free roll dial-up
website,
you must blah, blah, blah, blah
, blah, blah.
So maybe you typed your
password in.
Oh, I didn't change my password
.
Maybe-- but yet you typed it
into the phone, right?
Something like that.
How do I change my password?
I guess it's right here.
Hold on.
We don't want to change it.
You want to make sure that--
Well, I remember when I typed.
I mean, it's not like it's--
you know how it works, right?
I gave these guys my low
security password, right?
The one that basically
everybody has.
That's right.
I might as well just say what
it is, right?
Because everybody listening to
this, I haven't--
No, don't do that.
Don't do that.
Everyone's diving into their
Manila websites.
What's Dave's password?
[LAUGHTER]
That would be cool.
They can hijack your phone
number.
Well, no, then Manila would
just turn into a wiki.
That's awesome.
Oh, exactly.
It's the wikified version.
Oh, wow.
That would be great, wouldn't
it?
Yeah.
I can't find-- listen, this
user interface is so good.
You like it?
I hate it.
No, I'm only kidding.
Oh, OK.
It's so phone-like that I can't
find it.
They make-- even phones aren't
this difficult to operate.
Those are pretty bad.
This is really horrible.
I mean, it looks just like a
phone with a metal brush.
Oops, they go like that mic.
And by the way, that's why I
spent $3,000 on a great laptop.
On a what?
On a laptop so I could get a
cell phone.
But it's free.
Once it works, it's free, Dave.
Oh, free.
Oh, yeah.
As in beer.
Oh, cool.
Well, so did you do your
password?
I have not found a place to put
my password.
OK, it's on-- you got--
Shit, I hate this.
Skype sucks.
I totally know how to get to
the menu.
OK.
I got the menus down.
Right, under user settings--
system settings.
System settings.
Yeah.
System settings.
OK.
That way.
Very nice.
Network.
No, I'm sorry.
Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong,
wrong, wrong.
Wrong.
OK.
Wrong.
Fuck.
Bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, b
ing, bing.
Your time is up.
Shut up.
The correct answer is--
Be quiet, Dave.
Hold on.
Be quiet, Dave.
Tell her to shut up.
I'm not going to say that to my
daughter.
Oh, OK.
You're a horrible man.
Oh, yeah.
You're a childless man.
Yes.
I can tell.
Oh, god.
What, what, Christina?
She said I should shut the fuck
up.
Yeah, exactly.
Oh, man, this is--
you're like Uncle Dave, and you
're like Uncle Ernie from Tommy.
Now, where the fuck is the--
here, my sip username, we got
all that.
Where's the goddamn password?
Yeah, this is what I--
This is crazy.
So much for Uncle Ernie, right?
Wait a minute, wait a minute.
This is nuts.
Yeah, tell me about it.
Hold on.
Now, where--
I don't think you can change
your password.
Yes, you can.
I've done it.
I think once set, you are like
--
No, no.
No, don't tell me that.
I don't think you get to change
it.
No, that's crap.
That's horse crap.
Hold on.
Maybe the phone book.
Maybe we have to go to the
phone book.
[LAUGHTER]
Oh, man.
I hope Jeff Paulver hears this.
I mean, we're smart guys, right
?
Oh, yeah.
I don't feel so smart right now
.
Call settings.
It makes me feel-- this is my
favorite thing about software.
But yeah.
When I feel too smart, I just
launch some software
and I feel stupid right away.
This is horrible.
It's really good.
I understand.
Proxy default.
Oh, registering.
Hold on.
Uh-oh.
Oh, no.
Can you hear that?
I heard it work.
What?
Did it work?
I don't know.
You said proxy registering.
Well, I hit something.
What's your number?
The same difference.
Same difference.
What's your number?
Hold on.
Number is 495297.
It's not going to work.
Call up Kevin Werbach.
He works for the Paulver guy.
What?
He does-- they did the Super
nova Conference.
It was Paulver Communications.
Jeff Paulver, right?
Yeah.
Yeah, right.
OK, you're still not on-- wait
a minute.
Did you find your password?
Nah.
A whole lot.
What I did was--
This is going to piss me off.
Yeah, what'd you do?
What I did was--
to the green phone icon.
And right clicked on it.
Really?
Proxy's turned on.
Maybe I want proxy turned on.
Maybe?
I don't know.
But do I have that?
Let me see if I even have that.
No, proxy's still turned on no
matter what.
No.
I don't know.
That's dial tone.
Audio tuning wizard.
Welcome to--
No, you don't want that.
Oh, diagnostic log.
Where is that?
Oh, I have that.
If I right click under the
green dial button--
oh, shit.
Did I get--
Audio tuning wizard, diagnostic
log.
I don't see anything like that.
OK.
Well, that's not where you want
to be.
You want to be in your menu--
now this is so fucking crazy.
I was here.
I did this.
How come I can't find the--
man, my Mac is freaking out too
.
Oh, I have a little thing here
that says AC.
Does that-- wouldn't be your
initials, would it?
Yeah, what's it for?
AC?
AC.
Does it say that I called you?
No, it's just a black and--
it's flashing red, AC.
So you know there's another
hurricane going to Florida.
I heard about that.
There's already all kinds of R
SS feeds that track it.
I got to post that.
Yeah, yeah.
Anyway, so what you just didn't
hear was a whole bunch of crap.
Where it didn't work.
And it didn't work.
It was like an--
what was it, an hour and a half
of fucking crap.
All right.
I had nothing better to do,
like get a release--
Get a--
Yeah.
Exactly.
Nothing, nothing at all
important.
I'm going to leave it running
though, Dave,
because I know that when you
have--
on your lunch break, you're
going to immediately dive into
it.
Here's how it works.
You know how you do a crossword
puzzle,
and you go away from it, and
you come back,
and you find five different
moves that you just
didn't see before?
Yeah.
That's what this is like.
OK.
All right, Adam, it was a
pleasure talking with you as
usual.
Well, likewise.
It was this very ad hoc.
But let's see if we can get
something working
with that X10 phone.
If it does, otherwise I want to
do the--
you said it was tomorrow night?
No, when was it?
Monday night?
It's tomorrow night.
We'll check it out.
No, it's definitely not going
to be Monday night.
It'll be tomorrow night,
probably.
I mean, I'll check it out.
OK.
But yeah, yeah.
It'll be-- so that'll be Monday
morning for me,
so we've got to kind of figure
out what the time is.
Right, like in the middle of
the night for you.
Yeah?
Or early morning.
It'll probably be 3 PM here.
We'll find out.
6 will be midnight my time.
Yeah.
That'll be-- no, it's all due.
But hey, for in the name of
science, I'm happy to do this.
You're a scientist, Adam.
That's why I like you.
You're a scientist.
You have a PhD, right, in
science.
Anyway.
Hey, I'm going to hit the tune.
Let's get the fuck out of here.
OK, I'm out of here.
I'll see you, Dave.
Bye.
[MUSIC - THE DREAMS, CREWS, GAM
PITS, FOR YOU, BOYS]
It's trade and it ain't secrets
.
Trade secrets.
These heads will finally keep
this trade secret.
Trade secrets.
You don't need--
.